Jun 022014
 

Evidence has come to light suggesting that one of our recently elected tribunes may have been less than honest with us. (Well, with you, actually, because I don’t believe in any of the buggers.) I appreciate that the very thought of an untruthful politician may be a shock to some of the more delicate among you, so I can only suggest you gird up your loins, grit your teeth, and perform any other contortions that might help you endure what follows.

As the title of this post informs you, the politician in question is Nathan Gill, the Ukip candidate elected on May 22 to the European Parliament. Now Mr Gill looks a presentable forty-years-old man; happily married with five beautiful children, a dutiful son and a successful businessman to boot. It can be guaranteed that he gained the votes of many women, especially those of a certain age. That’s the JFK factor, exploited, since Dallas and the arrival of wall-to-wall television and social media, by Clinton, Blair, Obama, Cameron, and many other politicians in the English-speaking world. With the predictable corollary that those who fail the JFK test often suffer politically: Richard Nixon, Michael Howard, Gordon Brown et al. Lies may have forced Nixon from the White House but liars who pass the test are more likely to escape, or at least delay, retribution. This worshiping of the photogenic is yet another example of the superficiality of the Anglo-Saxon world today, the victory of style over substance. But I digress . . .

There are three specific areas in which Mr Gill was less than honest with the electors of Wales. The first two can be dealt with fairly quickly, but the third is a little more involved, so you’ll need to pay attention. It might also help you understand this post if you could refer back to an earlier post, Nathan Gill, Ukip No 1 in Wales; I would suggest keeping that earlier post open in a different window (or browser) so you can refer to it when necessary. (Here’s the link to the Ukip website from which the information came), with the bio panel from the site below.

NATHAN GILL, MORMON

People tell me that on other election literature produced by Ukip there were references to Gill being a ‘Christian’, which is unlikely to alarm anyone, but the Ukip election leaflet delivered to my house went straight in the bin, so I don’t know what it said. This was partly due to my views on English supremacism and partly a reaction to some of the insulting rubbish put out by Ukip in Wales. Whatever the leaflets may have said, none mentioned that Mr Gill is a Mormon. My belief is that few would have refused to vote for a ‘Christian’, but many would have been less ready to vote for someone belonging to one of the more exotic varieties of Christianity such as the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints (LDS).

Nathan Gill

Click to Enlarge

Seeing as Mr Gill is a Mormon, what is his attitude to gays and same-sex relationships? Come to that, what does he think of the kind of heterosexual relationships enjoyed by that pork swordsman, legendary drinker, and all round sybarite, Nigel Farage? Does he really see his party leader as ‘a bit of a lad’, Everyman re-born for the twenty-first century, or a sinner bound for Hell?

The fact is, we should have been told that Nathan Gill is a Mormon. We were not. The information was deliberately withheld. That was dishonest.

NATHAN GILL, PROFESSIONAL POLITICIAN

Ukip makes great play on the claim that they, unlike the ‘established’ (and discredited) political parties, are not made up of ‘professional politicians’ but of ordinary people who’ve just had enough of the professional political class. There’s no doubt that this plays well with an electorate that now puts politicians on a par with sellers of ‘pre-loved’ automobiles, and vendors of dwellings whose descriptions bear no reality to their true condition.

This situation is alleged to have come about due to young people studying politics, then working as assistants or advisors to politicians, before going on to become tribunes themselves. This process, it is alleged, divorces its practitioners from ‘real life’ and the concerns of ‘real people’, for whom Ukip of course speaks. It’s a message that resonates and, unlike most of Ukip’s messages, this one is based in truth.

In the address I used in the earlier post (right) Mr Gill first says, “From an early age I have been interested in politics . . . “, before telling us that he resigned from the Conservative Party to join Ukip in 2005. But then, confusingly, he proudly and emphatically states, “I am not a career politician”. Which is it? Maybe if we ask what he was doing prior to his election it might help. Ah, yes, he was working as assistant to his predecessor as Ukip MEP, John Bufton. So he’s a professional politician just like those his party vilifies. Another question mark against Nathan Gill’s honesty.

NATHAN GILL, BUSINESSMAN

In the earlier post I mentioned a number of business ventures with which Gill and his family had been, or still are, involved. One was Burgill Ltd, compulsorily wound up in February 2009 with debts of some £116,000. This was involved in the letting of property, Incorporated with Companies House on St. Patrick’s Day 2004. The directors at Incorporation, each having one share, were Nathan Gill and his mother; with Gill’s address given as 51 Park Road, Sproatley, Hull, East Yorkshire, England, and his mother living at a house in Bryan (sic) Aethwy, Menai Bridge, Anglesey, England (sic). The proposed Registered Office was in Scarborough, North Yorkshire, with the Agent in Preston, Lancashire.

I was unable to get much more information on Burgill at the time I wrote the earlier post, and felt disinclined to pay for documents from Companies House. That all changed late on Thursday night when I received a strange comment (since removed) to the post, some of which I can paraphrase here: “Nathan Gill . . . Burgill . . . migrants mainly from Poland . . . housed 46 people in one very large house on Holderness Road, Hull, 6 bunk beds per room . . . a perfect candidate for Ukip?” It would have been easy to dismiss this comment as coming from someone with a grudge against Gill or an anti-Ukip agenda, but when I made further enquiries things began to look less far-fetched.

Below you’ll find a series of documents linked to Burgill Ltd bought from Companies House. In chronological order, they are: 1/ Certificate of Incorporation (17 March, 2004); 2/ Debenture referring to mortgage taken out by Burgill (13 June, 2005); 3/ Annual Return (March 17, 2008) which now has the Registered Office in Llangefni, Nathan Gill living at a different address in the town, and his father having joined as a shareholder (Anglesey has now relocated from England to Gwynedd. Still wrong, but an improvement.); 4/ Details of the winding-up (12 February, 2009); 5/ the Current Appointments Report I downloaded on Friday May 30, which confirms the compulsory liquidation, tells us the accounts are long overdue, and reminds us that Burgill’s business was “Letting of own property”. (If they don’t show, then click here.)

Further enquiries revealed more information on Burgill and Nathan Gill which ties in with the mysterious comment sent to my blog. For example, trawling the internet I came across this piece which locates Burgill Ltd at 778 Holderness Road in Hull. More digging unearthed information about a planning application from Burgill, to Hull city council, for a new detached dwellinGill Holderness Roadg close to 709 Holderness Road. Also on Holderness Road, at 443, is a care home which seems to have been Gill’s parents’ business. Incorporated on March 27, 2001 it traded as the Pink Panther Resource Centre until it changed its name in March 2003 to Gill Enterprises Yorkshire Ltd, though now based in Menai Bridge. The attraction of Holderness Road may be explained by the fact that a Mormon church is located on this thoroughfare. No. 778 is almost directly opposite the church, across the dual carriageway of the A165 Holderness Road. (Click to enlarge aerial view below.)

UPDATE JUNE 3: I now learn there was yet another property on Holderness Road, this one No. 711 (also known as ‘Tower Grange’).  This is the most likely candidate to be “the very large house on Holderness Road, Hull, 6 bunk beds per room . . . ” mentioned in the comment to the earlier post on Gill. According to my informant this substantial building was Google Earth aerial view 2sold to another company, by Burgill Ltd, with planning permission for a two-storey extension of nine two-bedroom and five one-bedroom ‘apartments’, which would tie in with this document. Though Gill’s original planning application was for a three-storey extension of eleven two-bedroom ‘apartments’ and five one-bed. (This may also be relevant.) Elsewhere in that city with which we are becoming familiar, you may recall that on the Certificate of Incorporation for Burgill Ltd Gill’s address is given as 51 Park Road, Sproatley (a commuter village to the north east of the city). Well, I’m told that Gill “had four Polish guys living there and he never declared the cash”.

In what they say will be their last communication, my informant also refers to a church – presumably in Hull – owned by Gill for which planning permission was refused . . . with the building subsequently suffering a “mysterious fire”. (Though I make no connection between the two.) After which a compulsory purchase order was issued by Hull city council. I fear that in Nathan Gill we could be dealing with a very naughty boy, a very naughty boy indeed (even by the standards of Ukip), and a man totally unfit to represent Wales in the European Parliament. As ever, I would be grateful for more information.

Mentioning the Mormons again makes me ask out loud a question that keeps nagging at me. In my experience many religious sects have a very unChristian regard for lucre. They seem not to have read about Jesus expelling the money changers from the Temple. So while this post is premissed on the assumption that Nathan Gill was in business for personal profit, what if Burgill Ltd was in reality being run on behalf of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints?

Returning to the planning application (details below) for a new detached dwelling close to 709 Holderness Road, this is dated 3 April, 2009, despite the petition to liquidate Burgill being presented and heard at Llangefni county court by district judge Jones-Evans on 26 November, 2008, and the company registered as liquidated by Companies House on 12 February 2009! So how can a company that to all intents and purposes has ceased to exist have a live planning application? I’m open to explanations.

Gill Holderness Road 2

Next stop was the DueDil website, which has yielded much information in the past, and came up with the goods again. The chart below gives a pretty good outline of the rise and fall of Burgill. It starts in March 2005 with the company having assets of some £230,000 – a property, maybe accounting for the mortgage referred to above? – with assets peaking at £405,525 on 30 March, 2006 (was another property bought?). Things changed little until March 2007, after which it was downhill all the way, with no recording of cash after that date. Suggesting (and I stress suggesting) that after March 2007 assets were sold to pay off liabilities, for these always exceeded assets, and the last entries tell us that by March 2008 Burgill Ltd had liabilities of £116,571 and assets of just £504.00.

So what was Burgill’s business? Did it involve, as my informant suggests, Polish migrant workers and bunk beds? That scenario is not so implausible. Due to its location on England’s east coast Hull has always traded with the Baltic and would have been a port of entry for people from that region when Poland and the three Baltic States joined the EU on May 1, 2004. (Remember, Burgill was Incorporated on March 17, 2004.) An enterprising young fellow, with local links, might see money to be made. What we know for certain is that Nathan Gill was involved in the property business in Hull during that period, so if not Polish migrants packed in like sardines, what type of business was he running?

At this point let me briefly mention other information received that refers to “sub-letting”, and the suggestion that what’s on paper may not be a true reflection of Burgill’s financial position, as Nathan Gill is alleged to be a man who likes to deal in cash . . . much of which is said to have gone missing as Burgill dived south . . . which set off alarm bells with the tax authorities. It is also alleged that ‘Bishop’ Gill had another wife, with whom he was involved in an acrimonious custody battle, and that – how can I put this? – imaginative means were employed allowing the cash-rich Mr Gill to claim legal aid. These are all serious allegations, and there may be more ready to surface.

Burgill finances

Perhaps we should expect no better, for Ukip is a Ship of Fools, skippered by an arsehole and crewed by chancers and oddballs who regard probity, fidelity, and the better angels of our nature as irritants or obstacles to the satisfying of their baser instincts. They don’t much care about the destination of their craft – they signed on simply to enjoy the cruise and rake in the hated Euros. Far from being a break with a corrupt system Ukip is all the problems of modern politics magnified and made more repugnant. Nathan Gill adds another ingredient to the Ukip mix with his Mormon beliefs. Can we in future expect to see Ukip emulate the Tea Party in the USA by attracting Christian Fundamentalists and Evangelicals?

All this would be bad enough, but for a Welshman there is another consideration. Ukip is, as I mentioned earlier, an English supremacist party; it is the political voice of every social media bigot and internet troll who thinks we Welsh are an inferior people who would be ‘nothing without the English’, and that everything Welsh is, by definition, inferior to what England has to offer. The sort of swivel-eyed nutter, eaten up with hatred – often, it must be admitted, self-hatred – who will not be happy until every last vestige of Welshness is destroyed and Wales fully assimilated into England. It is scum like these that keep the Ship of Fools afloat in Wales.

I shall end this post by calling on Nathan Gill to, finally, be honest. Tell us why you withheld the information about being a Mormon, and how that faith influences your attitudes to contemporary issues. Why did you try to present yourself as a political virgin when you clearly are not? What exactly were (or are) your business interests in Hull with Burgill Ltd, and perhaps other companies; was it the exploitation of migrants from that place you hate so much – ‘Europe’? Finally, Nathan Gill, do you really think it’s wise to go to the European Parliament accompanied by so many skeletons, with others almost certain to emerge?

Trying to bluff it out will only make things worse, Mr Gill; I suggest you reconsider your position as an MEP.

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89 Comments on "Nathan Gill, Ukip MEP, Another Dishonest Politician?"

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A Black
Guest

Excellent post, well worth waiting for, need to read it a second time to get my head around it, can’t wait for our newly elected members reply!

Emlyn
Guest

Yeah, but if Gill quits due to pressure from the blogosphere, who is number 2 on UKIP’s list of luminaries? (I’d also like to know why Rod Richards couldn’t get a look in? Maybe they prefer clean-cut Nathan to washed-out Rod?)

Thinking Out Loud
Guest

i didn’t know until today that Nathan Gill worked for the former Welsh UKIP MEP John Bufton either, making his claims in a recent BBC Wales interview that he will be spending time getting to know how the European Parliament work rather hollow http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-politics-24444716

Not a criticism but why is this left to you to expose our newest MEP’s short comings when BBC Wales, ITV Wales, S4C and Trinity Mirror have considerably more resources. Are they unwilling or simply incapable of this type of investigative journalism?.

D Price
Guest

With the exception of mormonism, everything was very informative and I thank you for it. However, the obsession about him being a mormon bordered on religious predjudice and hate.

daffy2012
Guest

Exactly! That’s what I thought. Why is it left to a blogger to do all this research and expose his short comings? But excellent work Jac.

Alwyn ap Huw
Guest

One of the reasons for the success of UKIP is that the multi millionaire banker who leads the party is always seen with a pint in his hand and a fag in his lips giving the false impression that he is an ordinary everyday sort of chap just like you and me. Mormons however believe very strongly in the doctrine of the body being a temple that should not be defiled by addictive substances such as alcohol and nicotine; it is a tad hypocritical of Mr Gill to stand as a candidate for a party that creates an image for itself based on that which his faith believes to be an abomination.

Mormonism use to be fairly strong in Wales, especially in the Merthyr and Newtown areas; the reason why it is no longer a presence on the Welsh religious scene is that all of its followers were encouraged to leave their homes and travel to the new “Promised Land” in Utah; again it seems a tad hypocritical for a man who’s faith is based on a doctrine of migration to stand for a party opposed to migration.

DeanDwl
Guest

Re: Gill – looks like you’re getting the measure of the man..

Red Flag
Guest

Bit embarrassing all round really. Last year he shared a platform with local Labour Party councillors and Unite officers at a rally in Holyhead about a planned development. The rally was part funded and organised by both Labour & Unite and I never could quite work out why a UKIP MEP was given airtime at their expense.

daffy2012
Guest

It doesn’t look like we have much of a press to speak of in Wales…..except for some online-bloggs which are doing and excellent job.

Welsh not British (@welshnotbritish)
Guest

I think you are giving his voters too much credit. I’d wager that most didn’t even have a clue who they were voting for. They just liked the casual racism of Nigel Farage and thought they were voting for him. Quite why so many 80 minute patriots would vote for an English nationalist party is beyond me.

As for the press, I think we are giving them too much credit. They were creaming over the idea of Plaid losing its MEP and any negative publicity for UKIP could have persuaded a few of our three feather wearing part timers to stay at home and not vote for ‘our Nige’.

It might however be worth circulating this to some of the other MEPs, just the ones in Wales but ones who have been outspoken against these wasters in the past. http://youtu.be/0M4hExU-tfg

A Black
Guest

It was recycling day yesterday and I found a whole set of the European election leaflets, not much biography and not a word of Welsh in their one.
Nathan Gill Domiciliary and Residential Care Services Professional, that’s it, published in Heathfield TQ21 6UT, printed in Bodmin PL31 2DU.
Have a guess where the Lib Dem one was printed, you’ll love this , Pentrepoeth Road Morriston SA6 6AA

A Black
Guest

It will cost you a pint in the Dears Leap then, no thats it no mention of working in Brussels. James Cole Off-shore Construction Engineer, that’s his full biological details, its just their photos and six words.

PrinceMadoc
Guest

Shouldn’t you be going to the plod with this information..?

M
Guest

Martin Shipton of the Western Mail has been reading your blog. He mentions the bunk accommodation used for foreign workers and about Burgill Ltd. There is no mention of you, keep up the good work.

jason
Guest

lol, the author concludes by writing …[ukip] ” is the political voice of every social media bigot ”

After writing a lengthy article (via social media) commenting upon the Mormon faith in a bigotry manner.

Now that puts the C in contradiction lol

treforus
Guest

Your research has now been picked up by the London press. The Independent now has the story in some detail. Many congratulations. All the Welsh parties seem to have armies of “eager” researchers but no one sought to look. You have put them to shame.

A Black
Guest

Jac just watched Wales Today, Peter Hain calling Nathan Gill a hypocrite, what have you done!
An excellent piece of research for which you deserve all the credit.
You and Hain what an alliance, should send shivers down someone’s spine

Llyn
Guest

In today’s article in the Western Mail, Gill, who focused his Euro campaign and last year’s Ynys Mon campaign on anti-immigration, said that “Ukip has never said it wants to stop all immigration – it wants to limit the numbers”. This is simply not true as point 11.12 of UKIP’s 2010 manifesto states “UKIP would… introduce a…freeze permanent on settlement for 5 years (page 21 – http://devolutionmatters.files.wordpress.com/2010/02/ukip-britishness.pdf ).

While their 2005 manifesto states that UKIP would “adopt a ‘points’ system for evaluating applications for work permits based on an identified need for specific skills and other tests of suitability” (page 6 – http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/shared/bsp/hi/pdfs/15_04_05_ukipmanifesto.pdf )

As he employed non-skilled migrants paid at the minimum wage this clearly shows that he employed migrants that would never qualify under any UKIP manifesto and demonstrates clearly the hypocrisy of this man and that he should do the correct thing and resign immediately. I’m sure that as a man of no morals he will not even consider this path.

Well done Jac.

adarynefoedd
Guest

well done Jac

jason
Guest

“Peter Hain calling Nathan Gill a hypocrite”

Yes, the world has awaited with baited breath to hear Hain’s opinion.

Anonymous
Guest

Brilliant article excellent work

D Morris
Guest

Good work again Jac.

Willam Dolben
Guest

Good work Jac,

The sad thing is not so much the lack of investigative journal in the Welsh press but the inaction of the political parties in Wales. Did none of them think to scrutinise their opponents so they could turn up the heat BEFORE the vote? I mean even tin-pot companies run character checks on internet, facebook etc

I’m not sure about the Mormon issue. People have right pointed out inconsistencies on alcohol, migration etc but I think the key issue is that Mr Gill was either embarrassed about his religion or felt it would lose him votes. But religion is irrelevant to most people in Wales

The employment of EU and non-EU migrants in the key issue. Gill basically says that it’s the only way to run (a low-wage) business in the UK. So if immigration is limited further what future is there for UK business? Or does he plan on forcing the local working class work for less?

Secondly, is a business that relies on a state handout (or tender he might call it) really a private sector business? Is it innovation? Is it a business model that the UK could export, raising GDP? Absolutely not. It’s just public sector business outsourced (probably because of cuts). I have a business myself which sells to pharmaceutical industry but THEY receive almost all their income from the state so I see my business as part public sector. In the case of Burgill it seems to be a 100% public sector

People’s cynicism regarding the establishment (and that includes Labour in Wales) is at an all time high and extends to all politicians so if you say you’re not like politicians and all the existing politicians jump down your throat for hypocrisy it might fuel your popularity amongst the disaffected and cynical who will just say: “if they’re attacking him/her, they must be a threat”

In the US “knocking copy” is common in marketing and politics. I’m not saying non-UKIP parties should spend their time slagging off the UKIP but they need to keep a file….

I am pro-Europe and an immigrant happily settled in Spain. I had tended to think that the British press followed the FT’s motto: without fear or favour” and saw the UK press as more likely to expose flagrant hypocrisy amongst elected representatives than the Spanish and French press which I read regularly. But now I’m not so sure

GOOD LUCK
Guest

portsmouth ,plymouth up to same tricks there with his brother inlaws ? seems like you have him rattled ,how can i put thiS …THE BURGILL BONFIRE WAS SPECTACULAR LATELY ?

Cymro Wladfa
Guest

Jac, Cymru needs you, you are doing for Cymru more than all the coward politicians have ever done, we support you and a Cymru free of English colonisation,, Westminster asslickers and sepoys, once and for all.

Anonymous
Guest

You are a complete and utter prick. If you have contacts, publish them you spineless cretin

Cymro Wladfa
Guest

Anonymous and coward, nervous and scaredy cat.

PrinceMadoc
Guest

Oh dear 27, sounds like a UKIP supporter….
Bit hypocritical calling someone spineless when you post anonymously….:/

Clogau Shale
Guest

…Says ‘Anonymous’!!!

anonymous benefactor
Guest

I love the way an anonymous troll, too afraid to use his/her own name, calls you spineless! Today’s Independent has an article on Gill and the only reason it’s there is that you did the groundwork, and you stuck your neck out. Now you get abuse from cowards. Way to go, boyo!

D Morris
Guest

Spineless, prick & cretin indeed, yet you hid on this blog under the name of Anonymous………………..You gutless minion!

jason
Guest

“Whover gave me this information has now broken off contact, as he / she said they would. Most of the info came in texts from a disposable mobile phone that has now been disposed of.”

lol, now there’s credibility of source for you folks

Thinking Out Loud
Guest

The welsh media is on a roll, it’s has been caught flat footed for a second time this a week following Jac’s revelations about Nathan Gill, that great supporter of Wales and all things welsh the Telegraph has published an article today on how English immigration to Wales could see the Welsh as a minority in parts of Wales with decades.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/wales/10878554/Welsh-could-become-a-minority-in-Wales-as-English-set-sights-west.html

Anyone taking bets on another votle farce from Shipton and the Fail on this as well?

Sant
Guest

It’s worth remembering the so-called ‘final prophecy’ of Joseph Smith the founder of the Mormon ‘church’ – “You will yet see Wales, and fulfill the mission appointed you before you die.'”

Cymro Wladfa
Guest

Please see the comments now of members of Plaid Cymru in twitter in my account @gwynn10, defending English inmigration in the name of being inclusive. Jac, have you heard about Russell Elliot?

Cymro Wladfa
Guest

I realize now that Plaid Cymru is as you say, sadly. If the “national party” of Wales will continue to agree to uncontrolled English inmigration, Cymru needs another True “national party”

Llew
Guest

Great work on Gill , Jac. Very good digging. Though as we saw in England, scandals didn’t affect their vote really.

On English migration…firstly its not plaid’s fault whatever you think of them (they are one of the few institutions that actually uses Welsh and belongs to Wales). Secondly, it is hard to see how movements could be curbed or stopped. So the reactions we see here are frustration, understandably.

There have been massive migrations into Wales before. Look at Catalonia as well- their % of Catalans is actually lower than our % of Welsh. But because they have built strong national institutions and have a strong language (in a bilingual context) everyone is aware they are moving to Catalonia.

My hunch is that the English moving here are here to stay. They’re not going home, and the few that do have kids, will be Welsh kids. Wales will not disappear as a nation if we build national institutions. But we will not be able to control the ethnicities or origins of our citizens.

As such, Plaid has to try and win votes. It cannot do so if it is seen as exclusive, dodgy or racist. People that are already angry at plaid will not appreciate this.

As for joining labour, well on tv the other night Leanne Wood was opposing owen Smith and supporting self-determination. Has it ocurred that most people in Plaid, even or especially the left, simply have different politics to the Labour party? Why would they join them? Jonathan Edwards or Adam Price in Labour? Its bullshit sorry.

Anonymous
Guest

” following Jac’s revelations ”

lol, don’t you mean the *revelations* from ‘unknown’ ‘unnamed’ sources?

Mark
Guest

You article is good i give you that, but your views on Wales as an independant and the Welsh paries have to be strong and stand up for us, stop us becoming a minority are boarder line WELSH-IP you preach as though UKIP are racist and far flung well i ask you to read your comments again and maybe you’ll see the UKIP in yourself.

What even makes a person WELSH, heritage, language, place of Birth?
Its a persons belief that makes then part of a nation, “its in their blood i was once told”, BULLSHIT its in their Head…

@Cymro Wladfa – You think Wales is controlled by the English??? Do you know who Endward the VII is? and why we have a Prince of Wales… read about it with logic and not with anger and i promise come the end of the tale you will smile – my history teacher told me that once and he was right.

and all you complaining of Anon posting as Anon? is Clogau Shale, anonymous benefactor
,etc are they really your names????

UKIP got so many VOTES because of what their NOT (or rather claim not to be) rather than what they are. who votes for an anti-EU person to represent you in the EU i’ll never know. it’s like having a person who can’t sing, doing lead vocals in your band.

Cymro Wladfa
Guest

@Mark, really don’t see your point, I know who was Edward the VII, I know the story of the Prince of Wales, and? Why do you conclude that because I see the English as a menace to Welsh identity, I have to be with “anger”?, I’m hungry now, maybe, but never angry, well, maybe sometimes when a play football, lol.

Anonymous
Guest

“who votes for an anti-EU person to represent you in the EU i’ll never know.”

Yes, you’re correct; Evans has done so much for me in 15 years it’s unbelievable. The same Evans, by the way, whom when asked the question in a televised debate ‘so what do you actually do as an MEP?’ could not answer it, but rather stumbled and fumbled (as usual) for two or so minutes, not actually knowing what she actually does, you know, after *only* 15 years of doing the job lol

But yes, Evans has been ‘sensational’ in *representing* me.

We should all be blessed on the groundbreaking, innovative, life changing, difference making, life enhancing ‘representation’ that we’ve all had the luxury of receiving from Evans (plus Vaughan et al).

adarynefoedd
Guest

Migration by the English: real practical problems in the NHS and Social Services if English migration were to cease eg recruitment of specialist medical and nursing staff. It is difficult enough already to recruit in many specialisms. eg GPs, Health Visitors, Consultant Psychiatrists,social workers are a few examples. One particular reason is rurality and the lack of access to specialist resources, you as a professional are literally left holding the baby, also lack of access to training and to a professional culture. (for which a vibrant community culture is no substitute).

in Local authorities, many foster carers are English migrants, there are very few Welsh speaking foster carers. I have long puzzled about this phenomenon and have no answer.

Whilst I have a lot of sympathy with your views Jac, I do feel that to characterise English migrants as solely retirees, people with problems or good life hippies is not accurate in terms of the contribution made to Wales.

anonymous benefactor
Guest

Mark, I call myself anonymous benefactor because I once donated money to this blog. I do have a real name, yes, but I don’t use my anonymity to accuse people of lying and then run away – especially when the article in question is the basis for national media-checked and endorsed facts.
By ‘Welsh’ I mean, basically, Welsh, by which in turn I mean someone who identifies with the culture and respects it, and for whom respecting the culture involves understanding the place they come from, learning the language (if they’ve moved to a Welsh-speaking area, as I have done), and generally showing a degree of sensitivity to the matter of Wales not being England. There are also people who are Welsh by birth, heritage, language (which can also be English of course), who might find an anti-immigrant party like UKIP racist and bigoted because they do not respect the cultural identity of parts of the UK which are culturally distinct. These people want those who move to their country, town, village, area, to show the same respect to the local culture and language as UKIP – but also Labour and Conservatives – demand of immigrants to England.
I’m afraid there’s nothing racist about that. The problem with UKIP is that it is a part that promotes a totally anglo-centric view of the UK, and is also populated mostly by bigots, homophobes , misogynists and outright racists. Also, apparently now, hypocrites.
Being English myself, I can happily say that without feeling the need to defend myself from accusations of Welsh isolationism.
I love immigration, it’s great – but when the majority of your immigrants are white, retired, monoglot anglo-nationalists, many of whom are trying to escape multiculturalism, you don’t need to be a genius to work out Wales is getting the bum end of migration: monocultural, mono-ethnic, mono-linguistic.
That’s why I think UKIP are a disaster for all of us, Welsh, English, European, Asian, whatever.

Anonymous
Guest

You need to all settle down, take a deep breath and do the decent thing- that is vote and support the only true political party there is, and of course that is UKIP.

I mean, voting for one of the LibLabCon? Come on, they’re all part of the same establishment/mates in the media threesome?

Plaid? Come on, when you’re out and about talking politics again, just mention the words ‘Plaid Cymru’ to people. Just those two words: Plaid Cymru.Nothing else is needed. Watch, you don’t even need a punchline- you just say the words ‘Palid Cymru’ and people start laughing.

Vote UKIP.

Red Flag
Guest

And yet the voter statistics by local authority show that as a rule the more welsh an area is the worse UKIP did and the better the Plaid vote held up.

Anonymous
Guest

“The problem with UKIP is that it is a part that promotes a totally anglo-centric view of the UK, and is also populated mostly by bigots, homophobes , misogynists and outright racists. ”

I wonder sometimes if the people who write this sort of drivel actually get as board as others do in reading the tripe.

Red Flag
Guest

Why wasn’t UKIPs leaflet bi-lingual then?

Anonymous
Guest

Excuse the typo above: bored*

anonymous benefactor
Guest

Again, anon, I refer you to the INdependent yesterday: a juicy list of UKIP MEPs and other elected members who have – yes, come on now, admit it – said racist sexist homophobic and sectarian things. It also has several under criminal investigation for fraud. All this is in public domain, and fact, and while I agree some facts are ‘boring’ – many facts are actually – that’s what they are.
L

Anonymous
Guest

” a juicy list of UKIP MEPs and other elected members who have – yes, come on now, admit it – said racist sexist homophobic and sectarian things.”

Just like the mirad of LibLabCon councillors’ questionable behavior you mean, too?

http://www.worthingukip.org/homeukippolitics/articles-by-local-members/phil-rudock/17-liblabcon-councillors-arrested-charged-or-convicted-of-offences

You may not have heard of these though, of course, given that they are not UKIP candidates/ elected officals, hence get a media pass from the establishements parties’ mates.

Mormon in UKIP
Guest

I am active, participating “Mormon”, also within UKIP.

I find your comments and attitude towards the church extremely offensive and a solid example of some of the narrow minded anti-religious bigotry found within this country.

His religion is his own personal and private life, it has nothing to do with you and little to do with the electorate. That is the same if the issue concerned his sexuality or anything else. If he were a Muslim, no questions nor comments like this would be raised. This is just attempt to smear UKIP or find some cheap injustices with the election result.

Rather, people have all faiths and creeds alike have an equal right to participate within the religious process. The Mormon Church, despite its conservative values and upholds and teaches the importance of “Separation of Church and State” and thus we are unlikely to impose such on others.

There is also a Conservative MP who is a “Mormon” (MP for Macclesfield), likewise was there prior to 2010, a Mormon Labour MP in Bradford. If you are trying to UKIP out for “fielding mormons as candidates”, then not only are you being discriminatory but you’re also ignoring the rest of the political spectrum.

Please Respect our rights.

A. Davies
Guest

Here, here.

A. Davies
Guest

Hear, hear to Mormon in UKIP.

A. Davies
Guest

So – he’s a Mormon!! Duh, get a life. I’m a Born Again Christian. So you’re prejudiced against people who believe in the Lord, Jesus Christ. What’s with you people? Mae pobl Cymraeg wedi, a dal i fod, yn pobl Ddiwiol, DIOLCH I DDUW am hynny.

zxzxz@zxzxzxz.uk
Guest

I think the reason that Wales is behind England in public Services has 2 reasons. None to do with Labour running the country.
1) Wales has less public spending due to being a poorer country,
2) Wales used to be measured on the same grouping as England. So Wales was automatically equal with England and Wales as the category, even if in reality public services were poorer. When Wales is seperated from England it suddenley looks as if Wales is slipping down the rankings when in reality if Wales was below England in the rankings before.

Anonymous
Guest

I knew Nathan personally circa 1988. He in no way condoned his stepfathers behaviour. It was very hard on the family at the time. Nathan has always been foremost very centred on his religion. So “forgiveness” towards his stepfather was perhaps a part of that.
Nathan is, on a personal level, a genuine decent person. In Banff Canada where I used to live it’s really common to have foreign workers staying in dormitory style accommodation. I cannot imagine Nathan ill treating anyone.
He has, however, since age 14, been very interested in the economy. I think his church and the economy and English nationalism figure strongly here with his motivations.
I have read insinuations over a fire in Hull. This is just not something Nathan would do.

What you’re looking at here is a lovely guy with arguably misguided loyalty to his stepfather (for the sake of church and his Mum, because Nathan never did condone his stepfather’s illegal actions and was about 15 when it all happened).

Sadly the UKIP is clearly a party which borders on the neo nazi. The policies are, in my opinion, horrendous and this party is dangerous and should be stamped out.
So, why waste time trying to dig personal dirt up on Nathan? It’s a waste of time because he does mean to do good. He has good intentions and doesn’t realize that is party is morally offensive and would disgust most normal people.
It would be more productive to target his policies and the hypocricy of being an MEP who doesn’t believe in the EU. The UKIP is a sick dangerous force in British politics. Nathan was always right of centre but the UKIP is extreme right wing. Yes, I suspect that the book of Mormon and whatever it teaches features very strongly in shaping Nathan’s attitude and politics.This is how you understand this man. If a true understanding is what you want then money,mormonism and english nationalism are what anchor Nathan Gill’s politics.
As for him leading Wales, I remember he was in the “english”segregated class at school and did not speak any welsh. So rather surprised he is the “Welsh”leader.

Anonymous
Guest

I would like to add that although Nathan Gill represents vile dangerous right wing politics, he is himself not a dangerous man. He would not intentionally hurt people. He is brainwashed since childhood on a few levels but he is essentially well intentioned.
It is astounding that such a good person is an UKIP leader since the party is white extremist. I don’t think he understands the full impact of what he is representing. And I do believe that in his case religious extremism and right wing extremism go hand in hand and that mormonism is what is his guiding compass in his politics. I also doubt he would deny it.

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